melissaroth6868 Posted September 3, 2009 Share Posted September 3, 2009 (edited) I have an opportunity to rent a space (1,400sf) in a mall for just November & December. Here is some mall info: The average annual household income in the area topped $95,000 in 2008, with 22% of households earning more than $100,000. The majority of these high-income households are concentrated within a five-mile radius of the mall, where the average annual household income is just under $100,000. Major stores: JCPenney, Macy’s, Sears, Dick’s Sporting Goods Specialty Retail, Restaurants, and Entertainment: Aéropostale, ALDO, American Eagle Outfi tters, Ann Taylor Loft, Bandolino, Charlotte Russe, dELiA*s, Express, Finish Line, Forever 21, G by Guess, Gap, GapKids, H&M, Hollister Co., Journeys, Journeys Kidz, Lids, Motherhood Maternity, Origins, PacSun, Sunglass Hut, The Body Shop, Torrid, Victoria’s Secret, Yankee Candle, Zales Jewelers, ZumiezI would be taking over space so all store fixtures are included. I just have to stock up and move in....that's it. The cost is $5,000 per month for the two months with option to continue renting and stay there for the rest of the year.I'm waiting on some sales figures, because honestly, I have NO clue on what I could/should make in sales..... but I was wondering if YOU would do this?? If yes....could you please tell me why? Edited September 3, 2009 by melissaroth6868 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
momtohaley2004 Posted September 3, 2009 Share Posted September 3, 2009 It may make it easier for us to respond if you tell us what you make whether it's candles, soap, lotion, B&B products, etc. My first thought though if you are doing candles is that Yankee and Bath and Body Works both already sell candles. You want your product to stand out from the rest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissaroth6868 Posted September 3, 2009 Author Share Posted September 3, 2009 Uhhhhh, you mean you need information to help me make a decision???!!?! I....AM....SUCH.....A.....DORK! lolI do B&B only. I have a totally new "concept" for a store though. To keep it simple it would be "made to order" products. I just don't have any clue on sales. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starsmyles Posted September 3, 2009 Share Posted September 3, 2009 If you are going to make the products to order - I would consider doing more of a Kiosk instead of a 1400 sq. foot space. It would be cheaper, you would get the people who were just walking by and you would have a better idea for next year what you would need and how much you sell. hth ~*Sarah*~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meridith Posted September 3, 2009 Share Posted September 3, 2009 I think you need to consider some things before deciding. Do you have a customer base to make the money to afford that kind of rent? You actually have to make more to keep up with stock. I think its way too steep and way too much pressure. Especially if you don't really have an established customer base. Remember too that the economy is in the toilet. Many of those stores on the list are struggling too and they are established businesses. If an established store such as Pennys is struggling, do you think you can do better? Do you have the resources to put into this to compete with them? I've been to a few malls lately, in different states too, and they've been dead. It could pick up at Christmas though. I personally think it would be too much pressure so I can't say why you should do it. $5000 for rent alone is steep. I think you need to ask yourself if you currently make more than that to support that? Whatever you decide though, good luck. :smiley2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rae Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 I'm with Meredith. If you don't have a customer base I would shy away from that much rent. I was in retail for years with my businesses and Christmas time can be a nightmare. Customers are stressed out with the holiday time. You would have to make an awful lot of product just to make rent. If you have never been in retail I would think twice. HTH!Rae Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissaroth6868 Posted September 4, 2009 Author Share Posted September 4, 2009 I would consider doing more of a Kiosk instead of a 1400 sq. foot space. A kiosk is $8500 per month for those two months so it would be cheaper.If you have never been in retail I've been in retail. I have managed some type of store most of my working life.I KNOW it would be incredibly hard but I keep thinking that I just don't want to be 60 years old and thinking; "What if....????" Those are the two months of the year that ALL retailers look forward to. They bring those retailers "in the black". And MY idea of a "good month" and a big corporations idea of a good month, I'm sure, are MILES apart.Crap, crap, crap....what to do? lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rebeccajo99 Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 A kiosk is $8500 per month for those two months so it would be cheaper.Did you miss type in here? Some other things you need to think about is employee's and the extra expenses that come with that. Approximently how many people come to the mall. I'm guessing here, but I would think about every 10th person who comes to the mall will look at your stuff and probably every 5th one from those will actually buy is my guess. That has to be a lot of people to make up the cost of rent and employee expenses.Also, what do you mean "made to order" is that mean you take orders and then make it for them... like a custom order thing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrochet Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 Will you be able to keep up with the orders? Will make products at the store or will the customer place the order and you have to go home at night an fill the order? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LynnS Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 I wouldn't do it.$5,000 is a heap of money and a risk. Holiday time is good but still doesn't mean you will make that much in one month.Quite a bit of money IMO. TO much for me to ever risk and sure about most on the Board.I also wondered about made to order. What if you have 12 people getting ready for that special order and you have to make it.Some would just walk away.I see customers at my booth get impatient if one person is in front of them. I can't afford to hire someone to help me.Did you wonder if you can do it alone?? Would be very long hours during the holiday season.LynnS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NancyJo Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 Personally, I would wait too. You said it was $5,000/month, so right off the bat that is $10,000, just for rent. Are you required to carry any insurance? Do you need a phone line? Just some other costs to think about...I know you are excited about this, but maybe you should take a step back and think about it. This is already Sept and 1400 sf is a big place to fill with stock. You also said you do B&B and stated that you have The Body Shop in the mall already. What do you have that is different than them to draw their customers? It sounds like that mall is there to stay, why not look into starting something next year, starting slow with a kiosk and see how it goes. That way you can get a customer base, working towards a retail space if that is what you really want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissaroth6868 Posted September 4, 2009 Author Share Posted September 4, 2009 Originally Posted by melissaroth6868 A kiosk is $8500 per month for those two months so it would be cheaper.Did you miss type in here? No $8,500 a month for a 70sf cart (the kiosk rates are MORE).This would be really labor intensive and I couldn't do it alone. I would need to hire.Ladies thanks for your input. It's just really hard to make a decision without knowing sales numbers. I just contacted the leasing agent and hopefully she will come through with some information in the next few days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starsmyles Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 That is crazy that a kiosk is more - heres an idea for that space though im sure its against the mall policy 1400 square feet store- rent your own Kiosks - actually I wonder if you don't put it that way and did mingle with some other people who make some goodies and divided up the space if that would work - and you could split the overhead costs .... ~*Sarah*~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillowBoo Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 This year is a little different than last year or years prior when it comes to consumer spending...$10,000 is a big chunk of change to cover! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy123 Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 Ask yourself if you can afford to loose 10,000.00 worse case scenario. Even if you are only doing custom order you will still need plenty of products to stock your store if you want customers to walk in. Even affluent areas have been hit by the recession maybe you should talk to other stores owners in that Mall and see how business is going for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbuck Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 I have to agree with Andy123. I would make sure that I could afford to lose the $10,000 in rent to plan for worst case and hope for the best. Can you make products on site or would you have to do it somewhere else after hours? If you have to keep mall hours that could make for many many late nights.I wish you the best of luck on whatever you decide to do. Please keep us posted.Kim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twoscentsworth Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 Do a balance sheet..pros and cons. Also figure out how much product you MUST sell just to break even. Just for the rent you would need to NET $1,250 a week or around $200. a day. How much would that be Gross? (your product cost ) and remember this is JUST to cover the rent...you are not paying for anything else OR making any money. Do you have to pay for electricity? any other associated costs?How many hours would you need an employee(s) to cover for you? Whatever their hourly is you need to double that because you have to pay Fica etc. Figure out those costs. Once you figure out alll the costs involved you will be able to see how much product you would need to sell each day in order to just cover your overhead.Can you realistically make that much product and can you realistically SELL that much in one day? and as another poster asked, can you afford to lose 10K? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platypus Moon Posted September 6, 2009 Share Posted September 6, 2009 In Australia the big malls have open spaces in the middle that they rent out to "market like" stalls, i wonder do they have these sort of spaces there? i would imagine that would be a good way to put out "feelers" to see what sort of reception your products will get and be much cheaper? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debscent Posted September 6, 2009 Share Posted September 6, 2009 You are competing with brand name stores who offer discounts during the holidays. I think it would be a disappointment to you. $10,000 is just rent, does not include electricity, remodeling if necessary, fees for accepting credit cards, etc. staffing and advertising. I personally would not buy gifts for people (especially b& without trying it out myself first. Good luck in whatever you do decide to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starsmyles Posted September 6, 2009 Share Posted September 6, 2009 In Australia the big malls have open spaces in the middle that they rent out to "market like" stalls, i wonder do they have these sort of spaces there? i would imagine that would be a good way to put out "feelers" to see what sort of reception your products will get and be much cheaper?Those stalls that you are speaking of is what we call Kiosks - which this mall charges even more for!! ~*Sarah*~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeana Posted September 7, 2009 Share Posted September 7, 2009 How well does your stuff sell now? Where have you been selling it so far? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platypus Moon Posted September 7, 2009 Share Posted September 7, 2009 Was wondering that after i posted lol, what we call kiosks are the foody type shops. Those prices sound really high to me, and then do they take 10% of your sales ontop like some do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barncat Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 I recently inquired at my local mall...kiosks were 3500/mo and an 340sq ft space was the same price. They should also be able to tell u what elec and w/s are too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faerywren Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 That rent sounds a bit exorbitant to me. I checked into a kiosk at an awesome mall outside a very affluent suburb (house prices go into the millions) and it was only going to be $750/month. I had to make sure I carried at least $1 million in liability insurance, which upped my premium a bit. But that was all. If I asked myself now if I could stand to lose $10k...that answer would be a resounding "No". I don't know when it would ever be "Yes", actually. Be careful.~Julia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fire and Ice Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 I would never do something like this! You have to put the money forward to make all the product in order to stock the store. You have to make the rent plus paid employees? Where will you find the time to make product? The health department will not allow you to just make it on site. They might shut you down and you still have to pay the rent for both months.You would need better than a customer base of over 2,000 customers just to break even. And they all have to be in a buying mood! If you don't have the customer base, don't do this! You will lose your shirt and have to file bankrupcy!We had a local chandler do this, small store in the mall.: She lost her butt inside of one month and is still trying to pay off the debt! This happened seven years ago. She put the whole thing on CC and a loan! She now sees she made huge mistakes. Also, Malls are notorious for raising the rent right after you move in! She had a tiny store and the rent jumped twice in one month!I've been making candles for eight years and soap for two and there's no way I would risk that sort of money!Check with the health department to see if they would allow you to do this. They probably will not nor will your insurance. Every germ known to man is floating in a mall.:lipsrseal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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