sbs Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 (edited) I like the idea of all natural waxes. I started with cb adv. but wasn't pleased with the HT AT ALL. So I moved on to GB 464 which I heard was better. I do think it is a little stronger but not much. Is there a way to keep a candle natural (without adding paraffin) and have a HT the strength of Yankee??? Is that at all possible??? I walk into yankee and get an instant headache the smell is so strong. Yes I want them that strong Lol..I've mixed cba, 464, 444, and pb. My candles aren't nearly as strong as I would like them. I always use the max FO load too. Still light. There is only one FO that works as strong as I'd like and that is baby powder from CS. My tarts are strong when I use cba by itself but pb seems to make them weaker. So I'm going back to cba. So thats tarts but still having trouble with candles.I guess one of the reasons I am trying to stay "all natural" is so I'm not in direct competition with the many paraffin candles out there. Like you can't find all natural soy at walmart. I like natural but I hated working with beeswax and palm is so hard to find. Now soy is giving me headaches trying to get a good HT. I've spent $2000.00 in 3 months testing and I am currently unemployed. Was laid off last year and still haven't found a job offering more than minimum wage. My funds are low and I'm not sure if my product will please more than just family and friends.Editing to add that I have played with a variety of temps as well. Mostly heating to 185-200 and pouring between 135-170. I'm not so worried about how the candle looks since I use no dye. So can't see the frosting and the craters aren't too bad either. I just need a great HT. Edited February 25, 2011 by sbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonsie Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 Sorry to hear about your financial situation. Hope that things will get better for you money-wise.As for the HT, you mentioned in your post:I always use the max FO load too.That might be your problem. Have you tried lower FO amounts, such as 6%? Not sure why, but many other people have noticed that when they try to max their FO load, HT takes a huge hit. And at lower %s, you'll save a lot of money too. Definitely worth a try, if you haven't already tested it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbs Posted February 25, 2011 Author Share Posted February 25, 2011 Thanks Jonsie! No that is something I have not tried. I read it on here too a couple times that lowering the fo will help with HT... I just can't seem to wrap my mind around it. I will have to try it and see but I can't figure out for the life of me how it works, lol... Thanks again. I will post my results in a future post.:smiley2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soy327 Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 Wicking, are you burning off the FO with to big of a wick for your wax, Fo combo? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faerywren Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 There are more natural options, but an "all natural" candle can't exist if you use FO's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soy327 Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 There are more natural options, but an "all natural" candle can't exist if you use FO's.I agree, sometimes we get caught up in that "All Natural" you can say they are 100% soy if they are, but All Natural not if you use FO or Dye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbs Posted February 25, 2011 Author Share Posted February 25, 2011 (edited) I say that I use an all natural "wax". Not that it's an all natural "candle". I even explain on my website the difference between the two. :smiley2: So let me rephhrase by saying I would like to use all natural soy and have a great HT. From my understanding I can say all natural wax using 464, 444, and cba with the natural additives but I can't say it's 100% soy wax. I have not tried 415 or 135 (100% with no additives right) but might try it after a little more research. Either way, I'd be adding FO so no it wouldn't be an all natural candle but I prefer the soy over paraffin. Edited February 25, 2011 by sbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbs Posted February 25, 2011 Author Share Posted February 25, 2011 (edited) Wicking, are you burning off the FO with to big of a wick for your wax, Fo combo?Oh I've been through my share of that! Lol.. I have changed all my wicks based on CS's wick guide and have found all my container sizes burning way better, clean, and complete melt pools. I could try wicking down and see how that works too. Thanks for the advice. :smiley2: Edited February 25, 2011 by sbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lsbennis Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 (edited) You can try mixing it with some Coconut Wax...(different then coconut oil)...its kind of expensive but its an alternative to paraffin.If you get really frustrated you can throw a little paraffin in there, you would be surprised what only 10% can do to help with the soy, but your right, you wouldn't have a 100% soy candle. Edited February 25, 2011 by lsbennis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mindy5140 Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 Think about it when your walking into a store full of candles, sprays, etc... Of course it's going to be overwhelming. Not just one candle is making the store that fragrant.I would do all the suggestions above, still if your not satisfied I would move on. But be ready to have rough ugly tops before and after they burn. Cause that's what you'll get with 415 and 135. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbs Posted February 25, 2011 Author Share Posted February 25, 2011 You can try mixing it with some Coconut Wax...(different then coconut oil)...its kind of expensive but its an alternative to paraffin.If you get really frustrated you can throw a little paraffin in there, you would be surprised what only 10% can do to help with the soy, but your right, you wouldn't have a 100% soy candle.I'll have to look into the coconut wax. Thanks! And yes if all else fails I may have to add the paraffin and call it a parasoy candle. :smiley2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbs Posted February 25, 2011 Author Share Posted February 25, 2011 Think about it when your walking into a store full of candles, sprays, etc... Of course it's going to be overwhelming. Not just one candle is making the store that fragrant.Good point. :smiley2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lsbennis Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 SBS...here is a good detailed thread on coconut wax and mixing it with soy, it makes for good reading. http://www.craftserver.com/forums/showthread.php?t=95141&highlight=coconut+wax Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuzyK Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 SBS...here is a good detailed thread on coconut wax and mixing it with soy, it makes for good reading. http://www.craftserver.com/forums/showthread.php?t=95141&highlight=coconut+waxI'd pm you but I don't have that ability yet. I loved the way the coconut wax candles look. Did you ever try them wickless?Would you recommend doing a coconut wax/soy blend for melts/tarts?I'm in Oregon so ordering from Swans wouldn't be too bad on the shipping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lsbennis Posted February 26, 2011 Share Posted February 26, 2011 I'd pm you but I don't have that ability yet. I loved the way the coconut wax candles look. Did you ever try them wickless?Would you recommend doing a coconut wax/soy blend for melts/tarts?I'm in Oregon so ordering from Swans wouldn't be too bad on the shipping.How awesome that you are so close to them, honestly I don't know If it would make a good tart, its a very soft wax with a low melt point so you might want to give it a try maybe in a small amount so you don't end up with really soft tarts.Actually I never considered this wax for anything other then a very high end luxury candle due to the price, at $127 + shipping for 50lbs I would only use it for a coco/soy blend candle. It really does make a pretty candle, very white and creamy looking and it burns so clean.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbs Posted February 26, 2011 Author Share Posted February 26, 2011 SBS...here is a good detailed thread on coconut wax and mixing it with soy, it makes for good reading. http://www.craftserver.com/forums/showthread.php?t=95141&highlight=coconut+waxThank you!! On my way there now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leenabug Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 I've found out with 464 that its choosy about its FO's. (my opinion) Order a few oils from Bluegrass, Kentucky and TN Supply. (maybe someone can jump in there with the actual names/links.) Those oils always seemed to work better in the 464 than others. 1.25oz per pound of wax, cd wicks...............LET cure for 5 to 10 days before testing. IF thats not strong smelling something has got to be wrong!:smiley2:ps......the bakery smells always smell stronger........blueberry muffin , orange chiffon cake, etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonsie Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 ps......the bakery smells always smell stronger........blueberry muffin , orange chiffon cake, etcAmen to that! At 6%, my Gingerbread and Sugar Cookie scents are my strongest throwers by far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck_35550 Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 Yankee extrudes the fragranced mottling wax into pellets and uses automation to blend the pellets around the wick. I'm sure there are a number of steps taken to cure and they have perfumers who know how to get maximum performance from their wax blend. Yet Yankee is notorious for poor wick performance, soot and loss of fragrance strength about half-way through the life of the candle. Go buy a Votivo and get really frustrated. Take about 10 fragrances that have been posted as good ct/ht in your choice of wax and test them at various strengths, beginning at 6%. Test cure times beginning at one week. Test fo strengths with different wicks at best cure times, give these candles to people whose judgement you trust as testers and give them a survey to fill out. HTH. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennyjo Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 Think about it when your walking into a store full of candles, sprays, etc... Of course it's going to be overwhelming. Not just one candle is making the store that fragrant.I would do all the suggestions above, still if your not satisfied I would move on. But be ready to have rough ugly tops before and after they burn. Cause that's what you'll get with 415 and 135.I disagree. You can get a pretty candle with either if you are patient and learn how to work with the wax. 415 can make a very nice candle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarenOH Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 I would do all the suggestions above, still if your not satisfied I would move on. But be ready to have rough ugly tops before and after they burn. Cause that's what you'll get with 415 and 135.I have to disagree with this comment also. Have used 415 for 10 yrs and my tops are smooth before and after burning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soy327 Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Oh I've been through my share of that! Lol.. I have changed all my wicks based on CS's wick guide and have found all my container sizes burning way better, clean, and complete melt pools. I could try wicking down and see how that works too. Thanks for the advice. :smiley2:I'm kinda getting lost here in this thread :laugh2:so I'm going to cover HT and smoother tops. IMO if you wick down 1 size, use at the top 8% PP FO it's around 1.25oz and try pouring it when it gets cloudy into a warm (not hot) jar. Also try to cool the candles in a warm area (I have a radiator space heater in my room). I don't know if you said what jar Diameter and wick are you using? HTHAlso remeber some FO's just don't throw well in soy. I've had to learn this the hard way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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